Moses Ludel
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Posts posted by Moses Ludel
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David, that's not only felt, it looks like a bona fide dust seal! If so, the seal is a good way to protect against air leaks and to keep dirt out of the throttle shaft bore and engine. When you're able and willing, check for an air leak here. From what you have described elsewhere, this is probably not a dominant issue.
As for the auto-decompressor, the right side (brake pedal side) of the engine is the exhaust valve that has a built-in arm/link for the auto-decompressor cam. The tip-off is that the manual lever (handlebar lever decompressor) is at the left side of the rocker box, and this actuates (unseats) the left exhaust valve.
So, you're spot on: The auto-decompressor valve is the one out of adjustment now. And now I'm beginning to suspect that the auto-decompressor is "sticky" or acting up. You've done such good work on the rest of the engine and tune, including the carburetor, that there's little chance of a flaw elsewhere. A large clue is that the engine ran well then suddenly acted up and fouled the plug on both occasions. This could readily be a sudden loss of compression from the decompressor unseating the right side exhaust valve. The good news is that the right side exhaust valve (if adjusted anywhere near correctly) will not stay unseated long enough in the valve's normal opening cycle to shove a valve through the piston crown...
If this is the trouble, strive to free up the auto-decompressor short of my camshaft change solution. Sticky could mean sludge or an oil flow issue in the mechanism if the springs and other hard parts are still okay. The oil plunger plays a role with the auto-decompressor function...
Was this engine's oil maintenance like the rest of the previous owner/operator's maintenance? If so, it's likely due for a serious oil system flush. If you suspect this possibility, we'll put our heads together on a safe and suitable flushing method for this dry-sump engine. Also, have you changed the oil filter yet, and if so, how "dirty" was the cavity around the filter?
A possible solution would be a high "detergent", high lubricity oil. If you haven't drained that first fill yet, consider whether the rings have had long enough to seat. No blue smoke and strong compression, both accelerating and decelerating, would be clues. (Actually, with my XR650R engine, there was never a sign of blue smoke or any sensation of incomplete ring seal from the first start-up.) After flushing the system thoroughly, consider your synthetic oil if the ring seal is now sufficient, and let's get that auto-decompressor to at least do what Honda intended.
The reason I chucked the idea of using the auto-decompressor was the unpredictable jamming of the kick starter mechanism and erratic operation of this device during my first days of futilely attempting to kick the engine over. (This was when compression was absent, and I had not yet run the leakdown test that led to the top-end rebuild.) Without belaboring the point, that was enough "auto-decompressor" for me. Since the only possible advantage of this device is kick starting without thought or special measures, I opted out of the strategy. Again, thanks to the '69 BSA Victor 441cc experience with 9.5:1 compression, I did know how to use a manual compression release for starting a high compression thumper. The lesson apparently stuck, and more than 40 years later, I can kick start my Honda XR650R on one or two kicks (hot or cold so far, winter's around the corner for that test), using only the manual lever and no auto-decompressor. I'm delighted with the Hot Cams 'Stage 1' solution.
If anyone is interested in booting the auto-decompressor camshaft on a Honda XR650R yet fretting over whether the engine can start readily without it, I'd be delighted to do an HD video on my starting technique. It's highly effective and reliable, hasn't failed me yet! We can start a new topic on that subject...
Moses
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Wastintime...I like your approach here, heading back in the direction of OEM tire diameter (31.9"), keeping rpm under 2000 at your intended cruise speed. Let me know what you think of the Hypertech programmer, I'm continually impressed with the performance gains. Fuel efficiency is now determined by my right foot.
Moses
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Sounds like you're on the right track...
Moses
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Marc, this is really fascinating. If the cause of the PCM touchiness turns out to be engine oil wicking from the sender to the PCM plug, please let us know. This is a new one, but engine oil is easy to distinguish from other liquids, and your thoroughness may ultimately yield a valuable insight...We need to look at a factory wiring schematic to see whether the wire from the oil pressure sender goes directly to the PCM.
Keep us posted!
Moses
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David...From the photos, I would say that the throttle shaft looks okay, the bore in the body (can't see much beyond the bore end) has corrosion, can't tell whether there is wear here. The slide shows wear; any concern here, however, would be an air source above the slide that would supply unwanted air. The spark plug distinctly shows running very rich or incomplete combustion.
Is there anything unusual about the air filter or filter oil? Could the engine be "choking" from too much oil in the air filter? Did you buy a new OEM filter? They come pre-oiled.
The WD40 test is useful and may reveal an issue. Follow my proscription for running these quick leak tests. I like your analysis of the slide, you can test for leakage by spraying around the slide cover at the top. If no rpm change, it's likely not much of an issue despite the obvious wear. I'd want to solve the erratic running condition before condemning or buying a slide.
Another valve clearance check is prudent, you're expert now, so that should be a brief operation. If the gap keeps closing, and assuming the rocker adjusters are secured by their nuts, that's an indication of valve seat or face issues. Make sure you're checking and confirming the clearance after the adjuster nuts are secured.
Where was the valve work done? Do you have any idea what materials or process the shop used? New valves? New seats? 3-angle grind on seats? An issue here would cause compression loss. Cross fingers there's no issue here, the valve clearance check should help confirm.
You're running stock jets, right? 65 on the slow speed and 175 on the main? The spark plug looks like actual flooding of fuel, very rich indeed. Since the engine ran well for some of the ride then suddenly lapsed into misbehavior resulting in a fouled plug, it would seem like a sudden increase in fuel flow. You checked the cap vent, which when malfunctioning or clogged can pressurize the fuel system and unseat the float needle. Another possibility is either a high float level or sticking (open) float needle. Float height and drop is important. Too much drop can allow the needle to cock and stay unseated.
Your carburetor, if like mine, does not have a drop setting. Set float height with the body horizontal and the float's weight swinging into the needle, just enough weight to close the needle valve. Measure height now (16mm or 0.63" to top of floats from the carburetor body's float bowl mounting surface). Make sure both floats are even; correct and match float heights if necessary. There were many hands on this motorcycle before your good care.
A caution: On this carburetor, do not invert the carburetor straight up to check float height. If you do, the float will place too much pressure on the needle. You'll get a false float height reading. Overall, you want enough fuel in the bowl to keep from starving the engine. Too much fuel will leak and also pressurize the bowl, which can richen the fuel mixture. Do not press the needle into its seat with excess force, this will damage the needle tip.
Is/was there a hint of fuel seepage from the overflow vent hoses? An excessive smell of gasoline around the carburetor? If the carburetor is actually okay, is there something going awry with the ignition? You share that there's no sign of misfire until the behavior occurs. This is also when electrical parts in the stator or ignition warm up and act up.
As a final note/question...Did you replace or at least clean the spark plug thoroughly after the first round of fouling trouble? Was this a fresh or thoroughly cleaned spark plug we're viewing? An unclean plug can re-foul easily. Is this the right heat range plug for the XR650R?
Also, please share the "felt" photo you mention.
Moses
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Marc...Here are the parts schematics and numbers from Mopar. "Tapping" refers to self-threading screws. If any of your original screws are self-tapping and reusable, this might save a trip to the Jeep/Mopar source. Regardless, the part numbers are found here:
2002 TJ Wrangler Door Lock Mechanism.pdf
Trust this helps and saves time...I included full and half doors, scroll down the PDF.
Moses
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I do agree that the CPS would likely cause more than a #6 cylinder misfire. A more likely cause would be PCM connectivity issues. The CPS can be tested for ohms resistance if you're suspect that the sensor is acting up.
This oil wicking is intriguing. The PCM is way up in the bay on your TJ model. I could see the issue with a low mounted PCM, which was the case with earlier Mopar EFI systems. For a TJ Wrangler, this is a long way to wick! If there really is that prospect, a test might be to unwrap electrical covering from the oil sensor lead and look for evidence of oil weep. To suggest that oil wicks this far through actual wiring inside insulation is asking a lot. If true, however, any oil leak and wire to the PCM would be susceptible.
I'm very curious what you find with the oil wicking prospect. It's hard to imagine oil wicking from the CPS or oil pressure sensor to the PCM in the volume that's visible here. I do agree, though, that the substance does look like oil. This is a whole new possibility for PCM malfunctions if engine oil wicking is prevalent and able to wick all the way to the PCM! Could there be a substance inside the PCM that behaves like oil and leaks outward? This would point to a PCM issue.
A footnote on gas caps. It's helpful to press downward slightly when securing the cap to assure a good fit. The ratchet override is a preset for tension and does not always produce enough torque for a quality seal. Also, the tank filler tube lip needs to be clean and smooth for a good seal. This all sounds obvious, but a simple gas cap leak can lead to expensive and unnecessary troubleshooting and erroneous parts replacement.
Aftermarket caps are not always the greatest quality, either. I've had issues with key mechanisms, and it's reasonable to assume that the ratchet or sealing elements could fail early—which it did in your case. Same applies to Brand-X sensors, oil and temp in particular. I've had TPS switches and oxygen sensors fail, too. My suggestion is to cross the OEM part number over and use of the OEM parts supplier as a source for the correct part. As an example for Jeep applications, I use either genuine Mopar or strictly NTK (division of NGK) replacement oxygen sensors under the OE part number's direct crossover. This number is usually stamped on the original Jeep sensor.
Moses
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Good photos, Marc...You describe using dielectric grease. There's a lot of chatter about the use of dielectric grease. Permatex suggests that Dielectric Tune-Up Grease is a good barrier to oxidation at plugs, connectors and terminals. There are some online comments at forums that say not to place dielectric grease on connector pins.
I've gone to the Permatex site, and the information is vague:
"Protects electrical connections and wiring from salt, dirt and corrosion. Extends the life of bulb sockets. Prevents voltage leakage around any electrical connection. Also prevents spark plugs from fusing to boots. Required for modern high energy ignition systems."
Another quote from the Permatex site:
Directions for Connectors: 1. Make sure ignition system is off. 2. Clean surface with Permatex® Contact Cleaner. 3. Coat both parts of terminal contact with Dielectric Grease. 4. Reassemble, maintaining metal-to-metal contact. - See more at: http://www.permatex.com/products-2/product-categories/specialized-maintenance-repair/electrical-system-maintenance/permatex-dielectric-tune-up-grease-detail#sthash.mSLOFJcy.dpuf
Also, here's the PDF product information download from Permatex: Permatex Dielectric Tune-Up Grease PDF.pdf
In the PDF, Permatex cites uses for the Permatex Dielectric Tune-Up Grease:
TYPICAL APPLICATIONS
• Spark plug boots
• Distributor cap nipples
• Battery terminals
• Ignition coil connectors
• Headlamp connectors
• Trailer electrical connectors
The "metal-to-metal contact" reference may create suspicion for some about "Dielectric Tune-Up Grease". I've used this product for years around tune-up work without reservation. I searched around and found an engineer's assessment of dielectric grease that suggests Permatex Dielectric Tune-Up Grease should work well on a variety of pin connector materials without creating any kind of resistance or barrier to current flow. This commentary is worth reading: http://www.w8ji.com/dielectric_grease_vs_conductive_grease.htm, the author seems well informed, experienced, and he uses a scientific approach. According to the engineer, metal-to-metal pin contact should result if pins are clean and not tarnished, with or without dielectric grease on the pins.
It's realistic to presume that the degree of conductivity is governed by the tension of the pin and socket fit, not whether we use dielectric grease. Whether or not you use the dielectric grease, I would use a quality electrical contact cleaner to get rid of the oozing material at your PCM plug and terminals. Make sure you flush out all residue and allow complete evaporation to prevent dilution of remaining grease or any issues with spark arc hazards. I would at least place dielectric grease on connector lips to act as an effective moisture and oxidation barrier.
Personally, I'm good with the use of dielectric grease, others should use their own judgment. For me, the engineer at the www.w8ji.com site confirms and clarifies its intended uses.
Moses
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For any members having difficulty adding photos or illustrations to posts, begin by clicking on "More Reply Options" next to the "Post" button. Drop to the bottom of the full editor box, and you'll find the "Attach Files" button at the left. That will open up your computer file browser, where you can pick the photo file or any other file (several at one time if you like), then add it/them to the attachments. You'll see the photo(s) or file load. Now place the curser at the point in the edit box where you want the photo to appear. Click on the "Add" button next to the loaded file. The bracketed file description will appear in the edit box. When you "Post", the photo (thumb) or file (like the PDFs I like to toss out for folks) will appear in position at your post!
Take advantage, we welcome your photo posts...
Moses Ludel
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This is a relief, David, and it makes sense. Good that you were unable to operate the cycle much in this state...At least you know the carburetor is spot on now!
Looking forward to an update with your riding report, should reflect a smile on your face!
Moses
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Sounds like separate issues here. The 5VDC sounds like the trigger signal from the PCM. The pump itself runs on 12VDC. Confirm which circuit or lead you're testing, use the factory wiring schematic to separate wire leads.
Keep in mind that bad grounds can create a voltage drop. Any time you have a poor ground on a DC system, the voltage drops.
You could have a PCM issue, but given the low voltage readings, I'd begin with the grounds: battery ground, battery-to-chassis ground, engine-to-body, engine-to-frame, the PCM ground, ground at the fuel pump, etc. Use a volt-ohmmeter and look at ohms resistance, not simple "continuity tests". Let's not overlook the obvious, make sure the battery, when loaded, does not produce a voltage drop in a circuit or the entire system. Test the battery condition.
There is another test that helps when checking long wiring circuits including grounds: a lamp load test. (I talk about this test at the forums.) You can lamp load test a circuit far from the battery. I'd consider doing this on the fuel pump circuit if none of the other testing proves fruitful...If you advance to a lamp load testing approach, try a "Search" at these forums, using the keywords: lamp load.
Moses
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Marc, this is very good news. You've narrowed down strong possibilities for these two codes! Good job...Imagine how many consumers spend good money on bad repair bills when the problem is as simple as a bad seal at the gas cap or a leaky vacuum hose...Always best to pursue these simple solutions first.
The black oxidation is troubling. You do need to eliminate oxidation. Chrysler emphasizes not scrapping the contacts. I would use chemical cleaning (electrical contact cleaner) again and be optimistic that there was still corrosive/oxidant in the connections. Use Scotch Brite (Fine grade) if you must clean any contact surfaces. Avoid use of scrapers, screwdrivers or razor blades.
As for whether that was the knock cause, I see bad grounds and poor connections as an obvious possibility. Let's get that TJ reliable and predictable, then see if the ping occurs again...As for posting photos, here's a recent post I did...
Note: Some members are having difficulty adding photos or illustrations to posts. Simply click on "More Reply Options" next to the "Post" button. Drop to the bottom of the full editor box, and you'll find the "Attach Files" button at the left. That will open up your computer file browser, where you can pick the photo file or any other file (several at one time if you like), then add it/them to the attachments. You'll see the photo(s) or file load. Now place the curser at the point in the edit box where you want the photo to appear. Click on the "Add" button next to the loaded file. The bracketed file description will appear in the edit box. When you "Post", the photo (thumb) or file (like the PDFs I like to toss out for folks) will appear in position at your post!
Moses
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David...Part #1 does look like the O-ring. This is illogical and not the same depiction as the Honda shop manual schematic. We would not put the O-ring outboard of the washer. The pilot screw shoulder would chew up the ring. By design, the washer should compress or "sandwich" the O-ring against the seat in the carburetor's pilot screw bore.
The washer does go outboard of the O-ring and rides against the screw shoulder. This is the only way to get an effective seal and preserve the O-ring.
As a footnote, the screw should be turned in gently, as the O-ring is vulnerable. Seat the screw very lightly...I take care to make sure the thin nose stem of the pilot screw is engaging the tiny hole in the pilot bore of the carburetor body. If installed properly, the screw will be recessed into the body when seated. If it sticks out beyond the body, the screw is not aligned properly. As we know, a misaligned stem will bend under too much pressure.
Use care to make sure the stem of the pilot screw is centered on the tiny pilot hole...
Moses
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Lots of opinions out there, Michael...I asked around and found owners who have swapped a YJ Wrangler hardtop onto a Jeep TJ Wrangler tub. One installer shared that holes were drilled in the YJ hardtop to align with the Jeep TJ Wrangler tub. The swap was described as straightforward and easy, resulting is a good fit. The example is a 1995 YJ hardtop to a late TJ Wrangler.
Others may want to comment or add details here...
Moses
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I like your planned "checks", each makes sense, David...
Backing this up just a bit, let's rule out any engine assembly related stuff. You were attuned to the video during cylinder and head engine assembly. As I noted in the earlier reply, I walk the viewer carefully through the cylinder head nut tightening sequence and repeatedly use the reference "49 ft-lbs" final torque, even citing four recommended ft-lbs torque steps as you bring these nuts up to full torque, then a recommended recheck twice at the 49 ft-lbs. (All of this is between minutes 14 and 17 in the rental video.) If you followed these focused steps, the torque should be right, and you're past any concerns about the engine compression seal and air-fuel mixture dilution from a seeping head gasket. On that same note, the valve timing chain tensioner was presumably in good condition and should have tensioned the chain properly after installation. This would assure proper valve timing and chain tension.
If the engine is sealing properly, you're on the right track at the carburetor. If fuel volume to the carburetor is adequate, there are two concerns here. You reset the float, and that's a big one, as the float level must be high enough to keep fuel flowing sufficiently and not so high that there is flooding or spilling of fuel out the overflow vent tubes. Set properly, the float level will not seep fuel with the carburetor leaning moderately, like when the bike is on its kickstand.
So let's move to the carburetor idle pilot screw adjustment. Yes, you have the installation sequence correct: O-ring, washer, spring then screw. To clarify, this pilot screw is a fuel supply screw, meaning that as you screw it out or open it, more fuel flows into the air stream of the carburetor. If the engine ran with this pilot jet screwed in all the way, it's obviously getting fuel from somewhere. Before looking for an internal fuel leak (high float level, seepage past a passageway or casting, etc.), make sure the choke is opening completely. Find a stable idle point with the cable connected idle stop screw, even if the speed is somewhat fast. Now turn the pilot jet screw inward and out to see if that has any effect on idle speed.
If the engine won't idle down with the idle speed screw setting, usually it's not getting enough fuel. If it races and won't slow, its getting too much fuel/air combined. Extra air can be an air leak between the manifold and head or manifold and carburetor, and this would raise idle speed. Engine running (as slow as it is capable), take your WD40 and carefully spray around the intake (rubber) manifold with the engine speed as stable as possible. (Avoid spraying hot surfaces like the exhaust system, you don't want to set yourself, the bike or the garage on fire! A fine mist is all you should need, vacuum will pull the WD40 into the intake stream and change the engine speed.) If you hear a change in engine speed, there is a manifold or attachment point leak. Correct this.
Note: To rule out cylinder head gasket seepage, with the engine running, spray a fine mist at the head gasket mating point around the cylinder barrel and head. Again, avoid the exhaust heat and risk of igniting the WD40.
Other sources of air leaks can be the carburetor slide cover or the cut-off valve cover and port seal. Check these areas with WD40 mist, too. If there is an air leak, little fuel from the pilot jet may be enough to increase engine speed and give a "false" idle setting. Eliminate any and all external air leaks, beginning at the air box to carburetor inlet (to protect the engine from dust seepage) to the cylinder head.
Also, I would check for a throttle shaft leak, another point where air can enter from the outside. Visualize idle mixture as dependent on air only coming from the correct sources within the carburetor. Rule out slide to bore wear, which can also throw off the air flow—here, too much air seeps between the carburetor slide bore and the slide. Slide and bore wear was a notorious leak point on vintage British Amal carburetors, the Concentric type in particular. The engine would warm up, and the idle speed would creep up. There was a ready source of air and a fuel supply.
The slow jet and main jet should not be involved in the base idle speed and mixture issue. (You're using the OEM Euro slow jet, a 65, right? I'm running a higher flow 68 at 4400 feet elevation with no issues around adjusting the idle mixture.) Needle height should not be an issue, Euro OE clip position is 3rd groove from top, same place I'm using. Make sure the needle clip seats properly at the top of the slide. Be sure the needle seat is in proper position...If the engine idles at normal operating speed warm (around 1400 rpm) with the pilot screw turned in all the way, the carburetor is supplying fuel from somewhere. If the engine won't idle down to 1400-1500 rpm, it needs either air or fuel, or both—there's either an air restriction or a fuel restriction.
David, here are some helpful PDFs, a carburetor schematic and the factory steps for setting the pilot jet screw. Zoom-in for details on the schematic. Account for all of the parts within the carburetor:
Honda XR650R Keihin Carburetor Schematic.pdf.bmp Honda XR650R Keihin Pilot Jet Adjustment.pdf
Moses
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David, fuel hose disconnected to the carburetor, hold a clean can underneath the hose end, and turn on the petcock. Does sound like fuel starvation, and this can be the filter in the tank/petcock assembly. If slow or minimal fuel flow, drain the tank fuel and remove the fuel petcock carefully from the tank. See if there is an obstruction or clogged filter.
You do need a fuel filter, especially at Burundi. On my BRP, the petcock had disintegrated from setting with ethanol fuel in the tank during storage by the previous owner. The plastic filter was splintered and clogged, and I bought a complete (new) petcock with filter and gasoline-resistant O-ring (a must!). If you want to wait on the petcock and factory filter, temporarily eliminate the petcock filter in the tank, get a sufficient flow universal fuel filter for inline use between the tank petcock and carburetor. This is gravity flow and easy to accommodate. Make it safe and both leak and melt proof. I prefer Euro style hose clamps, the screw and nut band type.
Your 650 engine ran too well and started perfectly. There is every reason to suspect a fuel supply problem as a starting point for troubleshooting...We'll get you out on the road again! You've gotta experience this beast in top form...
The photo of your XR650R motorcycle with future rider nearby is very cool! No visit goes by without my Grandson Camden sitting on Grandpa's "Big Red Big"—three of his earliest words. Boys and their mechanical toys!
Moses
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David...So, we get Netflix and watched "Blood Ties". The soundtrack was right out of my high school era, I graduated in 1967. Johnny Rivers was popular, we lived at a rural ranching community. A handful of my school chums were into British rock. Johnny Rivers, Roy Orbison and other country/rock singers worked better in the local Nevada cowboy bars...I got into everything Motown shortly after high school but always enjoyed Johnny Rivers.
When we watched to movie, I was jerked back in time and went on a short refresher tour at YouTube around "Do What You Gotta Do". After Johnny Rivers, there was Al Wilson, Tom Jones and down the list. This was one of Jimmy Webb's greatest hits, he fueled the successes of Glenn Campbell and many others, including Johnny Rivers, obviously.
Here's what I found if anyone is curious:
"Do What You Gotta Do"
Classic Jim Webb sung by Johnny Rivers…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7NSjT27M3M0
Here’s a year later (1968) and Al Wilson pressing the same song on a 45-rpm disk at the UK. Note that Johnny Rivers is shown as the “Produced by” on the label…This is the true “soul” spin, a very clear and clean vocal rendition:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j7WzqirnQRI
I actually like this Al Wilson cut better, there’s also a “Comment” below by someone who heard this song in “Blood Ties” and got a rekindle like I did:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hi02YH039tg
Tom Jones couldn’t leave it alone and does a very decent rendition, especially as a live performer, getting "Tom Jones theatrical" at the very end. You can see how much traction the song had at the time, this is still the late ‘60s:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hMCjdnC40nI
This version goes far afield by Roberta Flack, a soulful rendition that relies totally on the lyrics, a major departure from the original rhythm and melody:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UFIZXCoOIm0
Also from Roberta Flack, who had a vocal gift, this significant breakout song became best noted for its role in the soundtrack for “Play Misty for Me”, a movie starring Clint Eastwood that was a sensation in 1971:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Id_UYLPSn6U
Nina Simone does it, too:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2jQC6L5Z108&list=PL79EA484ED19DD8CD
This is the Four Tops version, which is very well done, too. Motown overtones for sure. Lead singer Levi Stubbs nails it, he's Jackie Wilson's cousin, each had a great voice:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U0svbAv8bDQ
If this resonates, enjoy the flashback. That era spurred my purchase of the three BSA motorcycles in the early '70s. Unlike Bob Dylan's short interest in a Triumph (long enough to make an album cover at least), I never fell off my Beezers!
Moses
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There may not be enough bungee cord to hold this Dana 300 in gear...Emergency only, please!
Moses
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Very interested in knowing how this condensation issue turns out, RareCJ8! If that's the source, we'll work on a solution...
While the Rubicon is always fun, all of us at the Sierra region have been affected by the King Fire in El Dorado National Forest. Safe travels!
Moses
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David, if you used an MLS head gasket, there would normally be no need for re-torque. In the video, I devote three full minutes to cylinder head nut torque details. Review the video from 14:00 minutes to 17:00 minutes. Actual final torque, established by tightening the four cylinder head nuts uniformly and in cross, is 49 ft-lb. Yes, it's 49 foot-pounds or approximately 67 Nm.
Make a point of re-adjusting that head torque real soon to prevent coolant seepage into the cylinder or damage to the head gasket that would require removal of the head for gasket replacement. I'm very pleased and excited that you have the engine running, you're very close to a finished job at this point! If the head gasket is the tough MLS type, you likely are fine here if you re-torque the head now. (Regardless of the current torque setting, if uniform and equal, the gasket is flat and probably sealing.) This will require removal of the rocker box and, as you suggest, a fresh valve clearance check and adjustment. All of this will go quickly, you're familiar with the process!
Keep us posted...and congratulations, David!
Moses
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Fascinating, David, the photos say it all! I haven't seen innovative welding like this since watching the BMW frame repair at Mongolia during the 'Long Way Round' movie with Ewan McGregor and Charley Boorman. Hey, ya gotta do what ya gotta do! (A great song, incidentally, recently resurrected in the movie "Blood Ties". I knew the Johnny Rivers version from my high school days, the soundtrack in the movie was Al Wilson's take.)
The key to success with welding is the complete fusion of metal that underlies any weld. What you want here is enough heat to melt the base metal on each side of the weld, then the insertion of a metallurgically appropriate filler metal into the molten puddle.
This technology may not warrant discussion with these weldors at Burundi. However, I never underestimate the capacity or skill of any practiced weldor. Fortunately, welding is as much a hand/eye and intuitive application as it is academic and technical. When I taught welding, we had a particular student who did well with oxy-acetylene and went directly to TIG, laying down exceptional GTAW welds. Upon graduation, he wound up performing aircraft engine impeller repairs. His training was no different than others, and some students, frankly, failed to master the craft, never grasping how much heat to apply or when to dip the filler metal into a liquid puddle.
When I watch weldors, I'm absorbed in their "process" and immediately conscious of right moves and wrong. This is from practice that began with a year of welding training in high school. I was fortunate enough to experience the post-WWII methodology: start with basics and get as much hands-on time as possible. Our instructor, who doubled as the FFA (Future Farmers of America) chapter advisor, repeatedly drove home the fundamentals. As a result, we each learned to gas weld, braze and stick weld properly. I thank Mr. Gray, he paved the way for my later training and many years of professional welding around engineering plant repairs, heavy equipment repair work and automotive technology. When I can muster the time, I'd like to produce a series of welding instructional HD videos and impart that experience.
Best not to grind off any metal...I'll keep my eye open for a pristine stock muffler, David. Often, owners discard the OEM system when upgrading to performance equipment...Maybe we can drum up a backup unit.
Moses
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Welcome to the forums, Michael! Here's the rundown on what you face with this swap...
1) If emissions are an issue, the 4.2L, especially if still carbureted, would be a retro engine and not acceptable for emission compliance in states with smog inspection. If you have a Mopar EFI conversion (preferably a second generation system with single rail FI patterned after the '97-up TJ Wrangler), you might be able to get by with an inspector willing to ignore (or ignorant of) the earlier 4.2L long block versus a 4.0L engine. This would still be an engine change from four- to six-cylinder, which requires a smog referee station in California.
2) The 2.5L bellhousing pattern is entirely different than the 4.2L. (See my article at: http://www.4wdmechanix.com/YJ-&-TJ-Jeep-Wrangler-Clutch-Replacement.html. This is a 2.5L with AX5 transmission in a 1987-90 YJ Wrangler.) You also have an AX5 manual transmission in the '97 TJ, which was only used with 4-cylinder engines. This is an issue, as the AX5 will not work with the AX15 bellhousing, so you'll be seeking an AX15 transmission and bellhousing. The flywheel for the 2.5L could work with your 4.2L crankshaft, I've used a resurfaced 2.5L flywheel on a 4.0L engine. You'd need the correct pilot bearing for the 4.2L crankshaft and use of a manual transmission.
4) The real kicker is the frame. Both the Jeep YJ Wrangler and Jeep TJ Wrangler use a different frame for the 2.5L engine versus the inline six-cylinder 4.2L or 4.0L engines. At the magazine, I show what it takes to modify the frame and install a 4.0L or 4.2L in a YJ Wrangler originally equipped with the 2.5L inline four: http://www.4wdmechanix.com/MIG-Welding.html. The same principle applies with a TJ Wrangler's 2.5L four versus 4.0L inline six-cylinder frame.
Aside from the emissions legality issue, unless you have welding and fabrication skills, this could be a major project. The difference is the location of the side/front motor mounts. The 2.5L frames have the mounts permanently welded further back on the frame rails. Whether this was an engineering upgrade or for ease of production, the two-frame production method is somewhat puzzling. On CJs, the inline 4-, inline 6- and V-8 engines could be accommodated with factory bolt-in frame/engine brackets and even a cross brace bar that bolted into position. Beginning with the YJ Wrangler, AMC/Jeep adopted the four- and inline six-cylinder frame approach. Chrysler continued this approach through the Jeep TJ Wrangler era.
As a point of interest, the welding and fabrication that you see in my article is overkill compared to the OE frame brackets. The basic brackets are Advance Adapters products, the additional, reinforcing steel plate is by yours truly. The vehicle is my son-in-law and daughter's, and I wanted the mounts and welding to be indestructible for off-road, hard four-wheeling. Welding process is MIG, in this case with ER70S-6 0.035" wire.
Trust this helps clarify, Michael...
Moses
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You're welcome, Ax167...Let's make that YJ reliable!
Moses
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Ax161...Welcome to the forums. When the 2.5L runs right, everything is good? This sounds like the crankshaft position sensor (CPS) not getting a consistent reference signal during cranking. Whether or not you have rear main seal oil seepage, the CPS picks up oil and debris over time. Often the device is not defective, just dirty.
The CPS is at the back of the engine on the converter housing or bellhousing. When you're looking forward, the CPS bolts into position around 11 o'clock. Remove the CPS without damaging the plastic wire connector. Clean the CPS with electrical contact cleaner and test the ohms-resistance, moving the wires gently to be sure there is not a wire open. The test is across the "A" and "B" terminals at the CPS connector. The test is supposed to be run with the engine hot, although this gets difficult in terms of burning yourself, so be very careful. With the CPS connector plug disconnected and your ohmmeter leads between the "A" and "B" terminals, you should get a reading of 200 +/- 75 ohms.
In addition to the ohms resistance reading, you need a clean CPS probe. Try this and see if that's the fix. If not, we'll take it to the next step.
Another general problem area is poor or oxidized wire grounds. In particular, the engine to body and engine to frame and battery grounds must not be oxidized or loose. This turns up a lot with the early YJ Wrangler 2.5L. Check the ground attachment screws for oxidation and resistance.
Moses
Cherokee XJ 4.0L Idles Roughly and Misfires with Clutch Engaged
in Jeep® XJ Cherokee, MJ Comanche Pickup and Grand Cherokee
Posted
Powertrain Control Module, Ron...and there are no "stupid" questions here! The PCM controls fuel-and-spark management plus several other functions.
As a matter of semantics, I use the term interchangeably with "ECU" (Electronic Control Unit) and "ECM" (Electronic Control Module), as the term "PCM" applies to the majority of Jeep fuel injection systems—except 1987-90 Renix systems like yours! Yes, my PCM reference is really your ECU on the '87 Renix 4.0L EFI system or the 2.5L TBI system. Please excuse any miscommunication or confusion.
PCM became more relevant when these systems involved both the engine and transmission. In industry vernacular, the combined engine/transmission is considered the "powertrain"...
Moses