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Shopping for a Jeep CJ-7


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Hi all, first post here. I am looking for a CJ-7. I live in the Phoenix metro and have to pass emissions. A lot of listings I find are outside of that area and do not have to pass emissions. What do I need to look for to know if it's all still there? 

 

This Friday I'll be checking out a 1984 with the 258.

 

Thanks in advance,

 

Jay

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Hi, Jay...You're right to want all of the original emission control and BBD carburetor parts in place.  It is both difficult and expensive to chase down these parts.   If you want a quick visual orientation to the stock underhood items, see my two articles at the magazine:  http://www.4wdmechanix.com/4.2L-Jeep-Inline-Six-Tuning.html and  http://www.4wdmechanix.com/Rebuilding-the-Two-Barrel-BBD-Feedback-Carburetor.html.  The illustrations in the second article will prove helpful.

 

There is also the most recent exchange with fellow forum member "Forman", where I share a PDF diagram of the underhood vacuum circuit and devices.  If you put that schematic together with these articles, you'll have some perspective: http://forums.4wdmechanix.com/topic/518-1984-jeep-cj-7-42l-tune-up-advice-needed/.  Scroll down to the '84-'86 vacuum circuit PDF. 

 

If you're considering a 50-State legal EFI conversion, Arizona should recognize the California E.O. systems.  This would include Mopar EFI (multi-point patterned off later YJ 4.0L and TJ 4.0L induction systems) or the Howell EFI.  Either would help you enter the modern era and work around the BBD Carter carburetor and plethora of emissions devices and components on the '81-up Jeep CJs.  For a good orientation to EFI, see my article on the MSD Atomic EFI (not 50-State legal yet) for an overview of Mopar and Howell systems: http://www.4wdmechanix.com/MSD-Atomic-EFI-for-Jeep-4.2L-Inline-Six.html.  This is a multi-page article and includes installation of the MSD Atomic, similar to the Howell package.  Gauge the labor involved and your desire to perform this installation.

 

One way to approach this is to "plan" for either a Mopar or Howell kit.  Howell is complete for $1400 or less in the 50-State legal TBI version.  Mopar is nearly twice that at full retail cost if available...Doing a 4.0L MPI complete engine swap with a "good used engine" could be cheaper than a Mopar EFI conversion kit.  You would have a wiring challenge and other chores with the engine swap.  It's not a trivial undertaking.

 

When looking at a Jeep CJ-7 that has been stripped of emissions and vital carburetor components, weigh the vehicle's asking price against the cost of an EFI conversion.  Negotiate the price accordingly, allowing yourself plenty of room for the EFI conversion kit's cost.  (See the Howell Engineering site for current kits and pricing.)

 

The Jeep CJs of the '80s are very desirable with the Dana 300 transfer case, classic body styling and other features.  On the flipside is the engine's emissions and fuel-ignition fiasco that inevitably rears its head.  (This applies to 1987-90 4.2L Jeep YJ Wranglers as well.)  If I were buying an '81-'86 CJ that must meet emissions requirements, I would likely allow for a 50-State legal EFI conversion.  I have restored the MCU/BBD carbureted systems, and frankly, this is real work.  I am not against the BBD Carter carburetor in restored condition; the choice rests on the emission, fuel and ignition system originality and the number of peripheral pieces still in place. 

 

Study the engine bay and chassis carefully.  Vehicle history and originality is paramount with any used 4x4 purchase.

 

Moses

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Thanks for the very informative reply Moses. Several days before I found this website I ordered a copy of your book off of ebay. I'll get it next week I think.

 

The jeep I'm going to look at tomorrow has about 1000 miles on a rebuilt 258. That's good, but of course my worry is that rebuild time is when a lot of people decide to trash all the emissions parts. Now that I have a good idea of what should be there I'll be able to decide if I should buy it and offer price etc. I'd like to do the Howell kit install but it wouldn't be within my budget as an immediate upgrade. 

 

If I bring it home with me I'll post some pictures :)

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Well I did not buy that jeep. It ran very well and drove nicely. But all the emissions stuff was gone, Weber carb, no cat etc. I figured with a Howell kit and a new cat I'd have to spend $1500 at least to get it legal. I offered him $3300, 1200 less than he was asking but he wouldn't go below 4k. And for someone who doesn't have to go through the emissions BS it would be a pretty good deal at that price I think. Other than smog stuff, the one thing that concerned me was how difficult it was to get into and out of 4wd. Is that normal with the Dana 300? Supposedly it had been rebuilt too.

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The Dana 300 will shift readily from 2WD Hi to 4WD Hi.  You must stop the vehicle for the shift into low range.  For 2WD Hi to 4WD Hi shifts on the move, I like to depress the clutch, just like when shifting gears.  That takes the load off the gear set and enables an easier gear change.  There is also the issue of binding shift rails and other parts within the transfer case.  If an unloaded shift is still hard to make, there is usually something wrong.

 

I believe your offer was reasonable.  It's always a risk to buy any 4x4.  You were simply accounting for the known parts needed to make the vehicle emissions legal.  That's a wise consideration. 

 

You'll find the right Jeep CJ-7 out there.  If you exhaust that search and still want a 94" wheelbase utility Jeep, consider a 1991-95 YJ Wrangler with a 4.0L MPI inline six and AX15 transmission.  Newer technology, easier to meet emissions compliance, better parts availability.  Sure, the Dana 300 transfer case is gear drive and more rugged, but an NP/NV231 chain drive transfer case can still perform well for 150K-200K miles if maintained properly.  A YJ Wrangler might be worth consideration if you find rectangular headlamps acceptable—there are even ways to retrofit a grille with round lamps, using aftermarket pieces.

 

Moses

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Yes I hear you on the YJ Moses, but Chrysler made a lifelong enemy out of me back in 1987  :) .

 

I also just learned about the possibility of collector insurance exempting a vehicle from testing requirements here in AZ. I'm going to check into that some more and check out a 1980 CJ-7 tomorrow which is a mostly finished project I guess. Rhino lined all over, he's only asking $3000 since he has to close on a house in about a week.

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Understood, Jay...I appreciate the AMC/Jeep CJ era, too.  We're so fortunate to live at the Far West.  Friends in the Midwest can't find a YJ Wrangler that isn't rusted thoroughly through.  You're in prime territory for a highly restorable CJ Jeep.

 

1980 is the first Dana 300.  The situation sounds intriguing...Keep us posted!

 

Moses

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Well I bought this one for $2800. It has no cat but the collector insurance is supposed to exempt me from  testing. It does need a few things done. Tie rod ends need to be replaced as at least the drivers side has a lot of slop. I've never done these before but I assume I should do both sides regardless. It has a small oil leak, he said he replaced the rear main seal with a O'reillys one and it started leaking again. it also has a leak around the exhaust manifold gasket. Heater controls are missing, except fan switch. Wiper motor no good. Air box ? under the front cowl he said was rotten so he removed it. I have the cover. The transfer case shifter needs a boot. Fuel sender float is adrift in the tank. Those are the main things.

 

Anyway it's a 258 with an estimated 80,000 miles. 3 speed manual, is that original in a 1980? Not sure if it is a Dana 300 either but it does shift very easily at least. Shift pattern for the xfer case is front to back: 4H-2H-N-4L if that helps ID it.

 

4 inch Rough Country lift which I guess a lot of people don't care for, and a mixed bag of 31x10.50 tires with enough tread to last me a little while, 

 

But I think I got my money's worth. Only came with a Bikini top which is pretty cold this time of year (for us wimpy desert types anyway). I'll probably buy a new soft top/doors this week.

 

I got home too late to take any good pictures, I'll get some tomorrow and post a few if anyone wants to see yet another jeep :)

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Jay...Good price, lots of equipment.  You did a thorough assessment going in, likely very few surprises in store.  Is this Jeep rust-free with a straight body and frame?  Some photos would be welcome!  The "beginning" of a CJ adventure...

 

The transmission should be a Tremec T176, available with the inline six 258 in 1980.  This is actually stronger than the SR4 four-speed from that era.  You have synchromesh on all forward speeds, which is handy.  No overdrive, so that does limit the flexibility at both the bottom gearing and top end.  Not something to fret about yet, many get by nicely as long as axle gearing and tire diameter are a good match.  In low range, the Dana 300's 2.62:1 ratio will more than compensate for the three-speed T176.  There are also a variety of low-gear kits available, visit our friends at Advance Adapters!

 

This Jeep sounds like a "keeper", there are many transmission swap options, including truck four- and five-speeds like the T18, T19, NV4500, SM420 or SM465 and the NP435.  Of these, the NV4500 is massive and provides both a compound first gear plus overdrive at the top.  There are also lighter duty five-speed overdrives like the AX15 or NV3550.  All swap material.  The Tremec T176 will deliver for now.

 

Check the ID tag on the transfer case.  You should have a Dana 300 if the case is original.  This is a milestone year, the intro of the Dana 300.  You'll find several topics at this forum group that cover the Dana 300.  Compare illustrations with your application.  The unit has helically cut gears and a rugged design overall.

 

You have several initial target projects, we're all here to assist, just start new topics and expect comments back.  There are many AMC/CJ owners ready and willing to assist.  Two CJ-7 projects underway with 60Bubba and spdljohn.  Others like RareCJ8 and Kevin's 83-CJ8 can help, too.  Plenty of ideas in this group at the forums!

 

The rear main seal can be a touchy install in the chassis.  The late main seal kits are user friendly, though, and a main seal kit can be installed without tremendous difficulty.  The biggest issue is dropping the pan and working overhead instead of on an engine stand, upside down.  If you need some comments, I'm happy to help when you start that topic, Jay...

 

CONGRATULATIONS!...You've joined the elite group of AMC-era CJ owners.  Great stuff, round headlamps, too!

 

Moses

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Thanks Moses. Yes the body is straight and rust free, Here are a few pictures.

 

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I took it for a short drive in the dirt out here where I live, it will crawl in 4 low at idle. Haven't figured out the axle ratio yet but I'll probably get on that tomorrow. I also drove it down to the local general store and gas station to see how much gas it burned getting it home. 5.22 gallons for 94 miles on the odo. I'm not sure it's right though. I took a longer route home with it to avoid getting on the freeway but it should have been about 70 miles, plus the 5 today. While I was there I had two different guys come up and ask me about it and compliment it.

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Jay,

 

That is a nice looking Jeep.  I really like the Rhino Liner.  I Rhino Lined the inside and underside of the tub plus the fenders and firewall when I had my '83 CJ-7 all taken apart.  I only have a few miles on mine since I started putting it back together, but I like the bed liner so far. 

 

You mentioned using collector insurance to eliminate the emissions requirement.  When I was looking to insure my "newly valuable" CJ when I started the rebuild, I found that collector's insurance severely limited the number of miles I could drive each year.  Not sure what your long term usage will be for the Jeep, but you might want to ask about the mileage issue.  Mine will be a daily driver for at least several months, so collector insurance wasn't going to be an option.  Good luck, and enjoy the new ride.

 

Case

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Thanks Case. Yes there is a mileage limitation. I opted for 5000 per year which should be plenty. It'll be used as a hunting and general bumming around the desert vehicle. The other requirement of that insurance is that you do have another vehicle to use as a DD. So it would not work for everyone.

 

But here is the real pisser, I live in far west Maricopa county, and the dividing line for whether you have to do emissions or not is 2 blocks west of my address. TWO BLOCKS! I didn't know that when I bought the place  :) .

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Thanks for the photos, Jay, the CJ looks great.  For $2800, you did very well, and the "liner finish" is unique!  Rust-free, it will stay that way, looks right at home in your desert scape backdrop.  Arizona/Nevada, we have similar driving venues in our backyard!  I'm at a rural county without emission requirements (other than the Federal mandate, of course!), so I understand how your neighbors two blocks away enjoy their exemption from smog inspections.  

 

This will be a fun project, the Jeep looks intact and presentable, with a lot of originality.  You did your homework, it paid off, you'll have a great time with this Jeep CJ-7!  Keep us posted, and welcome to the CJ club...

 

Moses

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