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1973 I-H 1210 4x4 Pickup Owner Joins the Forum

I-H trucks International-Harvester I-H how-to I-H truck repairs I-H truck forum

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#1 Moses Ludel

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Posted 21 August 2013 - 01:11 PM

Hello, Moses!

 

I've got some questions for ya, i just bought a 1973 ih 1210 pickup. like you i was brought up around international harvester trucks scouts travelall etc. my step-dad worked as a mechanic at Grinnell implement in Grinnell Iowa. anyway my plans are to lift the 1210 but i cant seem to find any kits for that i would like to run 35 or 38 inch tires also it is real hard to find body parts for these old binders i'm looking for cab corners, rocker panels and maybe some floor panels. my binder "ol red" has a dana 44 in the front a Dana 60 in the rear a 205 t case but I'm having trouble finding out what engine and tranny it has in it i was told by the kid that i bought it from that it was a 392 the tranny is a 4 speed with what i call a great granny gear any help identifying these items would be greatly appreciated. 



#2 Moses Ludel

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Posted 21 August 2013 - 01:13 PM

Tatman, welcome to the forum discussions, I'm excited to see the I-H participation!  My cousin had a '73 1210 4x4 in the mid-'70s, what a terrific truck. 

 

I replied at your wheel size inquiry (biggman100's posting on the Roadkill database).  Now I have the bigger picture around your truck and am happy to elaborate...

 

As with any I-H, the Line Ticket sheet is gold.  If you have that still, you can part your truck down to the assembly line build components.  The VIN can also turn up information.  Years back, you could get a duplicate Line Ticket by approaching International-Harvester with the VIN.  (Worth a shot, even today.)  As a point worth making, the I-H trucks were built with the best components available in the industry.  1973-up 3/4-ton trucks like yours are often a prize!

 

Some quick questions and points to narrow down the truck's equipment:

 

1) Is the front axle a closed-knuckle with drum brakes?  Disc brakes and an open knuckle front axle were optioned prior to your model year, and your truck should be open knuckle with power disc front brakes.

 

2) Which GVWR rating (see the door sticker):  6300#, 7500# or 8200#?  This will help you identify parts and the load capacity of the axles and springs. 

 

3) If a regular cab with 8' bed, you're likely on the popular 131" wheelbase.

 

4) Your Dana 60 rear axle is likely 4.10 or 4.56 ratio, the 3.73 was typically for 3-speed automatic models.

 

5) Does the engine have a four-barrel (original equipment Holley with a stock air cleaner)?  Does the manifold look "stock"? 

 

6) You should have an I.D. plate on the transmission, should be an NP435 four-speed, there should be a round I.D. plate on the transmission. 

 

This is a great powertrain, the NP435 typically has a 6.69:1 compound low gear ratio.  Your iron case NP205 gear drive transfer case is an all-time benchmark for superior OEM quality.  This is the ultimate, and coupled to a 345 or 392 V-8 in good condition, should last a very long time.

 

There is the one-off use of an AMC 401 V-8, designated "400" in I-H 1973-74 applications.  (I've only seen these in Travelall models trying to meet emissions compliance.)  Your 49-State 1210 truck should have the bulletproof, industrial strength V-345 or V-392 I-H engine.  Provide me with the carburetor's "list number", begins with an "R", and if the original carburetor, we can narrow this engine down.  There are subtle differences between the 345 and 392, 345s are typically 2-barrel unless retrofitted with a four-barrel manifold.

 

Regarding your chassis lift plans, you're somewhat in luck here.  The front springs are leaf type and can be re-arched or modified by a quality spring shop.  You can use other period 3/4-ton trucks with your spring arrangement as a prototype. 

 

There are rear spring spacer blocks available in different widths and heights, also U-bolts and hardware.  With some creative measuring and comparisons, you should be able to build your own "lift kit" from aftermarket products available for other 4x4 trucks of the leaf spring era.  If you're really lucky, you will find front springs with similar width, length and eye diameters in an existing kit.  Shock absorbers require proper length increase to match the spring and block heights...We can discuss this further. 

 

As for wheels, if you chassis lift, you also want to widen the track width to maintain a safe center-of-gravity.  In this case, the backspacing and rim width will be determined by the proper "scrub angle" for the tires.  (See my discussion about front end alignment and caster angle at the topic Megatron posted.)  Your wheel bolt circle and center hole are common for other 3/4-ton trucks of the era (U.S. measurements). 

 

Ford and Dodge each used the Dana 60 rear axle with drum brakes, and a Dana 44 front axle was a Ford F250 approach—with two wheel hub center hole sizes, depending upon Ford's front axle load rating.  (Ford F250 went to disc front brakes later than I-H, to I-H and G.M.'s credit.)  You will likely discover a similar OEM backspacing on wheels built for Ford, Dodge or even G.M. trucks that use front wheel hubs close to the design of your 1210.

 

A local tire shop can confirm your 1210's wheel bolt circle, the stock wheel backspacing and any clearance issues.  This will turn out common to other domestic 4x4 trucks of this chassis size with Dana axles and similar brakes...I'm glad to assist further with your search.  Please share your findings, others will benefit!

 

When you lift, you will also need a dropped steering pitman arm.  Since I-H sought out the best steering available, your truck has a Saginaw steering gear.  You will find this used on Ford and GM trucks, and if you match your steering linkage design to the right truck, you will very likely discover a suitable, dropped pitman arm for that application that will work on your steering gear and with the 1210's draglink joint.  You may need a different draglink joint that will fit the pitman arm and also your I-H draglink sleeve.  We can discuss this further, too.  Safety is primary!  You'll likely want a decent steering stabilizer shock (universal mount) as well.

 

This is an exciting and durable truck to own and build for your purposes, tatman!  Expect my assistance and data to be available, along with input from I-H and Scout owners.  Welcome!

 

Moses  



#3 biggman100

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Posted 21 August 2013 - 03:33 PM

Tatman, welcome to the forums! While i dont know alot about the I-H line of trucks, i did find, after asking a couple people, a couple of I-H parts links that may be useful. I posted them under a different heading at the I-H forums.



#4 tinfoilhattt

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Posted 14 May 2014 - 12:12 PM

Hello-

 

I've owned a '73 IH 1210 [with a 345 and an automatic] for about 25 years.   Sadly, it's been sitting out in the back 40 for about the last 18 of those years with a broken U-joint and burned [?] tranny.  I've decided to either junk it or try to resurrect it for use as a firewood/plow truck.  Stock bed long gone, had a deteriorating all-wood 10' flatbed on it when I got it, it's only gone downhill these past 2 decades...if I raise it from the dead I'll probably put a metal flatbed on it.

 

I'm wanting to find out which transmissions were used on these.  Been told they used the same 727 as Scouts but really have no clue-about the only rigs I have some hands-on knowledge of are Datsun 521/620/720 series pickups-and THAT was 20 years back... 

 

Are there any easy Ford/Chevy/Dodge tranny swaps available if I can't locate a good used 727?  Or, how hard are the stock ones to rebuild?  OR, is a swap to a manual trans reasonably doable?

 

I'm not wanting to sink more than about $500 in parts and maybe 30-40 hours of time into this thing, I still have Datsun and Ranger 4x4's to use for pickup chores but when I was out looking at the ol' 1210 last week to see if I might be able to cannibalize the power steering for use on an old Massey-Harris 44 tractor I sorta had a nostalgic urge to drive it again.  Strange how inanimate hunks of steel can get under a guy's skin, huh?

 

Saw something that said it might be worth quite a bit more than scrap value on another site so I'm sure I could choke back my emotions and part with the old girl in one piece for the right price...I'm located in NW Montana, BTW.



#5 Moses Ludel

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Posted 14 May 2014 - 04:35 PM

Well, I'm partial to the I-H trucks and don't want to prejudice your thinking.  These were among the best light trucks built in their era, many would argue the best overall.  The truck should have a Chrysler A727 (Torqueflite) transmission, code 13407 or known in I-H vernacular as a "T407" transmission. 

 

This is a great unit, and if you're hinting that your skills include automatic transmission rebuilding, the parts are reasonably priced, and this 3-speed automatic is considered a "basic" unit from a rebuilder's standpoint.  I've rebuilt these transmissions since they first needed overhaul in the late 'sixties.  (The A727 dates to 1962 in Chrysler applications.)  Review a factory workshop manual or vintage Motors and Chilton professional grade manuals for details on rebuilding.

 

You could likely part out this truck to a restorer of a similar I-H light truck, some of our members have models with a similar chassis.  You'll have to weigh the alternatives and your degree of nostalgia.  Restoration can become a very costly proposition if the truck needs excessive attention.

 

Welcome to the forums, happy to talk "I-H" if you have needs...Plenty of tech details in my library!

 

Moses



#6 tinfoilhattt

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Posted 15 May 2014 - 04:06 PM

TYVM for fast response, Moses-I'll look around for a 727 Torqueflite.  Any ballpark guess as to what one in useable condition ought to sell for?  I see that the brake cylinders aren't exactly cheap...

 

Dean



#7 Moses Ludel

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Posted 16 May 2014 - 04:58 AM

If you can find a "good used" transmission, it should be a $300-$700, I would guess.  I generally see "good used" automatic transmissions as an oxymoron.  We're talking about a forty year old transmission, with dry seals and unknown wear.

 

Unless your transmission is visibly damaged beyond repair, I would consider removing the transmission and subletting the unit for bench rebuild at a shop.  This should be around $1200, maybe a bit more, depending upon hard parts damage.  A rebuilt converter is advisable, and this runs an additional $100-$150 as a sublet...

 

Parts are still readily available for these units, and interchangeability of parts would make the original transmission case and adapters the primary proprietary pieces.  The I-H engine requires a unique converter housing shape and bolt pattern.  If the transmission case, output shaft and tailhousing/transfer case adapter are intact and reusable, rebuilding your unit is a sensible alternative.  These A727 units are not the "$3000-$5000" modern rebuild, a seasoned shop should be pleased to bench build your transmission for a fraction of that cost.

 

Discuss this build with a reputable automatic transmission shop.  See if I'm right about the cost. 

 

Moses





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